NTW3 v8.1 SPC mod update

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Lord Davn
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NTW3 v8.1 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:21 am

:clap:
NTW3 v8.0 SP Campaign game mod changes & updates.

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:arrow: The campaign map and game economics has been updated for a more historical representation of the actual structures & facilities that would have been in place in 1805. This will allow players and the AI to focus on raising troops and achieving their victory conditions. To offset these upgraded facilities the starting funds and tax rate have been lowered so good economic management will still be important.
Managing & improving your trade routes can bring in much needed cash, hanging on to them will be a whole lot harder :confused:
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:arrow: Many of the building slots in the capitols have been filled in. The player has the option to change the facilities by removing the existing building but you will have to rebuild from level 1 facilities. The populations in each factions regions have been re-balanced for a more even distribution.
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:arrow: Gibraltar is a now a major fortress as it was in 1805, however the British garrison is limited in size and mainly for defense. The British player would be well advised to land a strong force on the northwest coast of Spain at Coruña to help take pressure off the garrison at Gibraltar.
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:arrow: The British Expeditionary Forces have been revised to reflect units from these various British garrisons that were transported to other regions as needed. Their recruitment cost is reflective of existing units maintenance cost. They can be recruited in Wales, Gibraltar, Baleric Is. and Sicily once Britain occupies the regions capital. https://www.historytoday.com/graham-darby/sicilys-british-occupation
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The British had a majority of their forces deployed overseas which is why they preferred to fund their allies to fight Napoleon on continental Europe.
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:arrow: Many of the blank port slots have been activated putting a higher emphasis on trade. This was a critical part of each factions economy and the reason for Napoleon invading the Iberian Peninsular to enforce his continental system. Port defenses have been added to the British & French trade ports to help stop marauding pirates. Historically they were old warships that were grounded NEAR the harbor entrances to ward off attackers.
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:arrow: The General units have been updated to reflect more of their actual character traits & abilities in 1805. These leaves plenty of time and opportunity for you to improve these stats on the battle filed as with Karl Macks unprecedented victory over the French in Bavaria.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Marshall Davout » Thu Jul 26, 2018 10:55 pm

Davn, that all looks pretty interesting. What is the relationship between v8.0 SPC and the mainline game? Will they be using the same factors / engine, or is everything separate now?

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Fri Jul 27, 2018 5:40 am

Marshall Davout wrote:What is the relationship between v8.0 SPC and the mainline game?

The NTW3 SPC mod & the Main battle mod shared many of the same unit stats and uniform files back when v5.0 was released. They are very hard to sync as the battle mod is customized for human vs human players while the SPC mod is more for single player and has to deal with the AI in battles (except for MP campaigns). Most of the NTW3 mods; Main Battle, HB & SPC are now independent of eachother due to each of their unique features and formats of play.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby BaronPelet » Sat Jul 28, 2018 4:41 pm

Look like some welcome and wonderful additions Lord Davn! My soft spot has always been for SPC so it is always great to see resources devoted to it. Cheers!

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Sun Jul 29, 2018 2:39 pm

BaronPelet wrote:Look like some welcome and wonderful additions Lord Davn! My soft spot has always been for SPC so it is always great to see resources devoted to it. Cheers!

I'm also looking forward to the improvements for the v8.0 SPC mod as they have been on my "to do list" for some time :wink:
There will be a download link posted here shortly for veteran NTW players to give the v8.0a SPC mod a test drive (it updates the existing v76 spc mod files) and provide feedback before release next month :clap:
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Herrputte » Mon Jul 30, 2018 7:29 pm

I cheered here so my wife thought i was mad and after explanation she was sadly not as excited as i am ;)

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Tue Jul 31, 2018 3:18 pm

Herrputte wrote:I cheered here so my wife thought i was mad and after explanation she was sadly not as excited as i am ;)

:snooty: She knows you will be immersed in campaign battles for control of Europe in the near future :naughty:
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:20 am

Hi Davn,

Wow, looks like some pretty radical (and certainly welcome!) changes, good job guys! I love the idea of shore batteries, does this mean that a fleet can't blockade a port anymore?

Just a couple of quick other questions: have the unit rosters/battle mechanics been changed in any way to be more similar to Classic Battles? will France be more likely now to invade Portugal and antagonise Spain, thus starting the Peninsular war?

Cheers

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:52 pm

Black Serpent wrote: I love the idea of shore batteries, does this mean that a fleet can't blockade a port anymore?

The shore batteries for British & French trade ports will keep enemy ships from sailing into the harbor and destroying the dock facilities. They can still however blockade the trade ports. The main focus of the 1805 campaign is the war with Austria, Russia and at some point Prussia. Much of this is hard coded by CA into the campaign game AI.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:36 pm

OK. I was asking because in the diplomatic relations (perhaps in startpos or acually in the db, can't remember) I know one can set a deterioration of relations constant, which acts to gradually degrade the diplomatic relations with time. So it could be done that Spain and France start off as allies and gradually over turns the relations deteriorate until finally they might declare war. So by 1808, the Peninsular war could begin in the campaign. At least this was true in Empire, I've done that to make the Iroquois and British friendly and finnaly allied against the French in Canada.

https://www.moddb.com/mods/french-india ... /fiw-packs

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Thu Aug 23, 2018 12:04 pm

Thank you Davn. I tried to reply to your PM, and send a new one, but my messages are stuck in Outbox, not sure why... I will therefore post part of my PM here:

Are you interested in changing the Franco-Portuguese and Franco-Spanish diplomatic relations then? To eventually lead to the Peninsular war by 1808? You probably know this already, but to do this you need to edit the startpos.esf file with the ESF Editor tool. See screenshot at link below, since attaching images on this forum is rather complicated:

https://mega.nz/#!R4FFmK6Z!yn_AkBzmtUYbeO833LVIWPqK4N8YczBDQJdErRUVcmo

Some more information can be found on this thread:

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?275411-Diplomacy-editing

A few quick notes on the test version.

- The battle mechanics seem to be much better, esp. for cavalry, nice job there!
- I still see the old unit selection UI (for ex. when selecting buildings, it's the standard UI, unlike the screenshots you posted recently).
- I haven't seen the shore batteries on the French coast, nor how to "recruit" them, am I missing something?
- HMS Victory still has incorrect sailing. It always falls behind the rest of the fleet, and has a really hard time turning, making it useless in a fleet engagement. Even though it was a big first rate, it was actually comparatively fast, outsailing some smaller second rates in the RN. At the moment it sails worse than the Santissima Trinidad...

The sailing is adjusted in unit_stats_naval, in db.pack. If you are unsure which values to put, just find another first rate ship entry, or use the same as the second rate (very slightly lower numbers for acceleration, turning speed etc). Worst case, I could do this and send you the data, let me know

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Thu Aug 23, 2018 3:20 pm

I'm familiar with the diplomacy setting and did extensive adjustments to them way back with the v4.0 spc mod for the specific relations that existed at the start of the Third Coalition wars in 1805. Portugal was neutral and just trying to stay out any major conflicts with the major powers (especially Spain). It's difficult to program the AI for specific scenarios with the changing dynamics of the campaign map as the war evolves.

If your not seeing the correct ui or coastal batteries in the trading ports then your files are not loading correctly. Lord Wesley went through the sailing stats with me to make adjustments for HMS Victory and the other First Rate warships. I'll check them out myself first chance I get.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Fri Aug 24, 2018 8:56 am

Lord Davn wrote:I'm familiar with the diplomacy setting and did extensive adjustments to them way back with the v4.0 spc mod for the specific relations that existed at the start of the Third Coalition wars in 1805. Portugal was neutral and just trying to stay out any major conflicts with the major powers (especially Spain). It's difficult to program the AI for specific scenarios with the changing dynamics of the campaign map as the war evolves.


Indeed, I see what you are saying. Yes Portugal tried to stay out of fights, but just before 1808 Napoleon imposed the Continental System across Europe, and used Portugal's refusal as a pretext to invade them (so, poor diplomacy would be an UNDERstatement). In doing so he marched through "allied" Spain, who resented strongly the heavy French presence in most of its key strategic cities - the French were performing a de facto "silent" occupation. All these event led to an uprising in Spain (could be coded through public order tweaks? revolution?), who toppled the king and PM Godoy. Again, this was Napoleon's pretext to put his brother on the throne of Spain, which led to the Peninsular war. I thought that by changing diplomacy settings, somehow it would be possible to have French armies marching through Spain and into Portugal.

These events occur right in the middle of the 1805-1812 main campaign period, so it wouldn't be quite right to focus every French effort on Austria/Prussia/Russia. Esp since that leaves Britain out of the main land fights with France ... ;) I feel that Britain's objective of taking Madrid is technically good, but if feels like they would have to fight Spain rather than France to do it... Would have been cool to have as an objective the "LIBERATION" of Madrid, and taking Toulouse by 1812, or the end of the Campaign.

But, of course, I certainly apreciate that this is quite hard work and depending on many unpredictable variables, and understand if it is too difficult.

Lord Davn wrote:If your not seeing the correct ui or coastal batteries in the trading ports then your files are not loading correctly. Lord Wesley went through the sailing stats with me to make adjustments for HMS Victory and the other First Rate warships. I'll check them out myself first chance I get.


Small correction: When I play as France, I see the batteries in the trading port. However, as Britain, I can sail in and destroy the French trading ports unimpeded.

RE the HMS Victory, just sail the fleet around at FFWD, turning a few times. After 5-10 mins or so the Victory falls behind, and bringing it into the thick of the action (or where the other ships are, still decently grouped together) is painfully slow.

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Fri Aug 24, 2018 10:41 am

After the loss of the Franco-Spanish fleet at the battle of Trafalgar, the alliance between France and Spain became somewhat pointless, and tension began to rise. Spain resented the French dictating terms all the time and trying to spread their new political system, while France did not like the political instability in Spain, and preferred to have a stronger and more reliable ally at its southern border.

I feel that after Trafalgar, Franco-Spanish diplomacy could worsen, while an uprising in Spain could develop around 1808 (can these be directly set up, like for example the revolt in Cairo in the Egypt campaign? that one always happens no matter how appeased the population is). Playing France, one could receive a mission in 1808 to invade and conquer Portugal. Or have it as a victory condition?

Anyway, sorry for the flood, I'm just floating some ideas to increase the campaign immersion, especially when playing as Britain.

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Herrputte » Sat Aug 25, 2018 8:44 am

coastal batteries; they spawn after the first turn and you cant fight a normal fight against it , autocombat works though and i captured one at a point but it was left stuck in the channel.

sea battles, seems almost same , exception is it seems admiral is more important than ever? Had ship led by inferior admiral by far surrendering due to "high losses" when lost 4 sailors only.

Swedish 86gun ship : still crashes as hell. Maybe replace with the portuguise 86 gunner if its preferrable to have one .

Ground combat, i feel its a bit smarter, the computor? reacts better and no eternal blobs as i seen so far (only a few battles played though)

Metalled roads, you have metalled roads now as in vanilla, 99 tunrs and 9999 in cost. Intentional or bug?

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Sat Aug 25, 2018 5:51 pm

We will work to fix the ship bugs. Macadam roads did not exist until 1820 when invented by Scottish native John Mac Adam. They we're removed from the game in v4.0, thx for catching that one.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby BaronPelet » Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:16 am

Lord Davn,

As France, I've gotten to Jan. 1807 so far but I figured I'd share what I've seen so far. Some of these observations may be wrongly attributed to the workings v8.0 files since it's been a couple months since my last NTW campaign play-through but I hope they may be of use:

- Battles seem to be nice and competitive with a fair amount of bloodshed as the AI has some proper shootouts, I don't steamroll battles as easily as I remember
- Blobbing still present when CPU defends but not nearly as troublesome as in the past, they seemed to snap out of it more quickly and act more decisively afterwards. Would campaign line of sight have any impact? I like fog of war for MP but for campaigns I wish it was reduced a bit against the CPU
- The one siege battle I played was a sortie by the CPU, no real problems there
-CPU (particularly Austria) seemed rather aggressive on the campaign map, which I found rather enjoyable
-Port batteries work fine for me, I don't play naval battles so no real report on that from me.
- Diplomacy seems fine as well, I was able to broker peace with Britain for Hanover and Prussia declared war at a logical time and accepted peace after a serious loss (but I hadn't even captured any territory)
-Crashes on occasion but maybe less so than previous installments
-The new economics worked well for the most part I think, although I had a lot of trouble with Austria rolling in with 4 or 5 full stacks in central Europe (with another few in reserve at Vienna/Croatia areas against my splintered Corps of typically 75% strength by spring 1806. A nice challenge as they pushed me back to the Rhine to regroup so no real complaints! Prussia and Britain also fielded a fair amount of soldiers as well, and I faced an additional Russian full stack.
-I'm biased but I wish there was a bit more cash flow for France for balance when Prussia enters the fray, maybe tweaking the amount of tax revenue or something but maybe that would just lead to French steamrollers
- I know British invasions into Brittany probably can't be tweaked but perhaps lowering their standing army forces to maybe make a land engagement more likely closer to 1807? I know it's tough without an ability to ordain a "Peninsular War" and keeping but just a thought
- I like the new traits and such for generals, good addition
- Kutuzov was just "Kutuzov" on his nameplate, wasn't sure if that was intentional or not
- This is more out of curiosity than anything else, but what determines which generals are available and when? Can this be edited so like Marmont and Bessieres appear before Vilatte and Drouet ?

All in all, wonderful work, Lord Davn! I feel like I can certainly stick with this campaign more faithfully than past installments, I felt more immersed this time than ever before with NTW3. Keep up the good work!

Cheers!

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Tue Aug 28, 2018 1:45 am

BaronPelet wrote:- Blobbing still present when CPU defends but they seemed to snap out of it more quickly and act more decisively afterwards.
-The new economics worked well for the most part I think, although I had a lot of trouble with Austria rolling in with 4 or 5 full stacks in central Europe
-I'm biased but I wish there was a bit more cash flow for France for balance when Prussia enters the fray.
- I know British invasions into Brittany probably can't be tweaked
-Kutuzov was just "Kutuzov" on his nameplate, wasn't sure if that was intentional or not
- This is more out of curiosity than anything else, but what determines which generals are available and when?

Thank you for the detailed report, it confirms what I was seeing in my play testing.

-- The AI blobs on defense have been a curse since v4.0, adjusted the db tables for our custom units and it appears much improved. The AI sees all units on the battlefield otherwise they'd just stumble around looking for you. My suggestion is to setup near the middle or rear of your deployment box when attacking the AI. Then send out scout units to locate and move your forces up to engage.

-- We've done some tweaks to the db tables and the AI is actually pretty good at managing its economy. Players will need to focus more on the economics at the start of the campaign now. Lord Wesley recommends reducing the tax rate at the start to build up the population, then raise it with the increased population later on and you will have plenty of revenue to spend on your army.

-- The British AI is hard coded to invade Brittany, not much can be done with that. The Ottomans were hard coded to start war with Austria (and Russia) so we restricted them through diplomacy code scripting to remain neutral so Austria & Russia would keep their focus on the French.

-- I've fix Mikhail Kutuzov in the text file. There are three Generals we can set in the recruitment list, after that the AI does it by random choice.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Herrputte » Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:52 am

Played 3 campaigns so far, Denmark , Holland and Sweden.

Crashes : The only CTD/freezes i have had is ONLY when swedish 86gunner is involved sofar. Kindly remove that ship.

Portbatteries; I managed to capture one and it was stuck in the channel but i managed to capture the adjacent country and to place that battery in harbor and repair but later i ceeded the country to a protectorate and then it was placed in channel again (managed to capture two frigates with it) cant move, behaves and looks like a 50 gun vanilla fourth rate.

AI: seems more intelligent, sure you beat pretty much everything if you have good defence against the initial onslaught. only thing i see if its a combat against a fortified town , but thats always quirky, i mean the hassle you have when trying to get your own troops to use the cannons on wall...

Seabattles: have some tweaks been done there? Its trickier and the ships fights harder , more ships are sunk now. You can still force surrenders via two or three ships raking at different angles .

Overall i enjoy this mod immensily (apart from swedish 86gunner) well done! And thank you for opportunity to try this!

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Sat Sep 01, 2018 6:15 pm

Herrputte wrote:Played 3 campaigns so far, Denmark , Holland and Sweden.

Thank you for the comments, we've worked hard to improve the campaign game.

==>The Swedish 86 gun will be removed. The port batteries are as you noted 50 gun vanilla ships with no movement points so they stay in the harbor and the AI can not move them. There are some minor drawbacks but overall it improves the port defenses against constant raiding.

==> The AI does seem to be much improved with less blobbing on defense and using The Hedge Knight group formation files to form Battle lines.

==> Lord Wesley gets credit for the sea battles those are all his modifications and improvements. We did add separate mods for British French and Spanish naval uniforms.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Marshall Davout » Sun Sep 09, 2018 12:47 pm

I am playing through a campaign as Britain. Will post more feedback in time.

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Mon Sep 10, 2018 6:03 am

I'll look forward to it.
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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Marshall Davout » Mon Sep 10, 2018 11:41 am

Maybe you will :P

So far, the problems are mainly old ones:

- Lost all my artillery trying to cross a bridge. Something about moving on bridges that wipes artillery out completely
- A few crashes during battles. That isn't new
- I got a request to take Hannover, to help my allies against French aggression. Which is fair enough, but Prussia has declared against France and already and taken it
- The French are having a lousy time of it. Apart from me destroying their fleet, the Austrians seem to be holding them
- I think I like the changes to dockyards, but I am not sure I understand them. I have a dockyards in England that can build lots of things, and a dockyard in Gibraltar than can only build sloops

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Black Serpent » Mon Sep 10, 2018 2:36 pm

Some more feedback for the British faction, probably too late but maybe useful for a possible future patch.

* First, A wonderful effort to give each unit a historical description and their stats to roughly correspond to what they would have been historically, well done! (this applies for every faction btw). I also confirm the battle mechanics are much improved.

* Regarding the British, I really believe that their uniforms should change, slightly. At the moment they have the uniforms of 1815, which is well past the Grand Campaign time range 1805-1812. Specifically, the British uniforms should correspond more to the Peninsular War: infantry should have stovepipe shakos, not Belgic (introduced in 1812, really implemented in 1815!), and light dragoon uniforms should also be different (Tarleton helmet, plain white trousers and knee-high boots). Overall, the Peninsular Coalition faction in 'Classic Battles' has I believe the closest depiction of what the British army would have looked like for the Grand Campaign time range. Also, would be nice if, like in Classic Battles in v8.0, the highlanders would each have their regimental kilt tartan!

* Also getting my head around the shore battery. It's a good idea, and I think it should stay. Would have been great though to make it impossible to actually fight it with a fleet, but to just force an autoresolve every time. I don't know if that's possible, but it would certainly make it more immersive than fighting essentially a naval battle with what should be a shore battery of guns.

All in all, great job Lordz, really looking forward to the release date! I would be happy to continue the discussion in pvt, if you think it might be useful - feel free to PM me, either here or on the Lordz Discord server (I sent you a friend request, Davn).

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Re: NTW3 v8.0 SPC mod update

Postby Lord Davn » Mon Sep 10, 2018 7:45 pm

Marshall Davout wrote: So far, the problems are mainly old ones.
I think I like the changes to dockyards

Try adjusting the graphic settings :wink:

The AI would constantly raid the British & French trading ports, destroying the docks and taking a long time to rebuild them. The port defenses keep the raiders out of the port but they can still blockade it. They're basically 50-gun ships with no movement points so they do limit ship activity coming out of the trading ports. You have to load British & French troops out of a dock facility in order to move them out to sea.
Gibraltar was historically a naval base for repairs and replenishment, hence the small dock facilities. The British can use Gibratar for repairs but they have to build their main war ships back at home.
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